The terrain generates as you explore it. that's the whole business model right there. hard to monetize a destination when the philosophy says you never arrive.
I think this is a really interesting critique of Jung's philosophy, but I largely disagree.
Maybe this is just a quirk of the person who introduced me to Jung, but I view his core project (The subset of his philosophy you are critiquing here) as deeply democratic, and not demanding of therapy at all. I don't think he is even close to a self-help writer, rather, something closer to a scientist of the self. I think he is trying to create a model of 'The Self' that maps onto reality more accurately than the models of his peers (I.e. Freud) and I think he does that very well. I don't think subscribing to Analytic Psychology demands that you do anything. There are strong therapeutic implications following Jung's self model, and he actively communicates to other clinicians. But I'd argue that if you understand the mechanics and dynamics of neuroses, you are amongst the group of humans least dependent on therapy. (My most recent article on fate and magic is proof that at least some of us can trigger profound shifts in our ways of living largely sparked by Jungian thought).
There's also the question of action (Or 'building' as you put it). Again, Jung's core project is to construct an accurate self model. Let's imagine 2 people are each trying to make a tangible change in how they live (i.e. building a new better life). All else equal, the one who has a better understanding of their mind will do a better job of making the required changes. The 'Solid ground that you built yourself.' you mention is easier to build with more self-knowledge. But I'm repeating myself now.
That peer of yours who used 'Reflection' as an excuse to become a recluse sounds like the 'foolish new analysant' type that I'm currently reading Jung's critique of. To speculate a bit, I think this personality type is experiencing something like weak ego-inflation. Which tbf can lead to stagnant behaviour that you criticise. But I think that says more about the individual than Jung's model of the self. After all, ego-inflation is a Jungian concept.
Maybe you should stop reading tweets about Jung and start reading Jung himself. The individuation process is both internal and external at the same time. Jung never said it's only internal; on the contrary, in "Memories, Dreams, Reflections" he explicitly said that the only reason he kept his sanity was because of his patients, wife, and children.
I'm sharing my own experience and what I've seen around me.
You seem to be more familiar with his message so please share your experience with individuation.
Notice I also said different philosophies work for different personalities, I don't deny he has helped people but the raft metaphor still stands for me. If the shore is available why not go for it?
the whole point of looking to your interior is to act on the exterior. that's the double character of the individuation process (which can be symbolically represented as the lab - acting on the exterior - and the library - looking to the interior - of the alchemist). I can agree that it doesn't work for everyone; I myself don't go to a Jungian analyst.
I see Jung's thought not as a raft that will save you, but as a tool, somewhat like a lens that can help you understand the World and yourself.
I'm only saying that your problem isn't with Jung or Jungian psychology, as it clearly says that your actions in the exterior are the main purpose of life itself.
And, as Jung said: "Until you make the unconscious conscious, it will direct your life and you will call it fate."
I agree with most of what you’re saying. If you don’t take action, nothing changes. But I also find that people act in ways that are counterproductive to their goals because they haven’t connected their past to their present beliefs. They need to do some processing of subconscious beliefs to feel that they can act in more productive ways.
No law of physics states that people need to process subconscious beliefs. We made it up. Does it work for some people? Yes it does, but it doesn't have to be an universal law. This is what I'm trying to convey with this article.
He forgot the most important part or didn't have the science to tell him what it was about the empaths in the first place in individuation he forgot first principles... it's all about the Divergent. Who don't peek until 35.
And this Divergent has an Evidence chain all the way back from the beginning through objection AIS fraudulent start and exactly what they're planning to do .mand have already done with a 13 million seeded for it and I've got a secret secret I've got a secret! Domo arigato Mr Roboto domo domo domo
The thing with introspection is that you have to put it with action. Introspection gives us insight on what to do and then act on it.
Knowing your psyche is good but doesn't mean that's the only thing you should do.
It also allows you to develop strengths you never knew. Like conquering certain weaknesses and then actively narrowing it.
Yes, introspection is passive in essence. If it doesn't serve action and doing, it's just passivity.
Introspectiveness has become mental masturbation... great work Conquer (also big congrats on 10k!)
Very often the case yes. Thank you!
The terrain generates as you explore it. that's the whole business model right there. hard to monetize a destination when the philosophy says you never arrive.
Definitely… the subscription model is more profitable.
I think this is a really interesting critique of Jung's philosophy, but I largely disagree.
Maybe this is just a quirk of the person who introduced me to Jung, but I view his core project (The subset of his philosophy you are critiquing here) as deeply democratic, and not demanding of therapy at all. I don't think he is even close to a self-help writer, rather, something closer to a scientist of the self. I think he is trying to create a model of 'The Self' that maps onto reality more accurately than the models of his peers (I.e. Freud) and I think he does that very well. I don't think subscribing to Analytic Psychology demands that you do anything. There are strong therapeutic implications following Jung's self model, and he actively communicates to other clinicians. But I'd argue that if you understand the mechanics and dynamics of neuroses, you are amongst the group of humans least dependent on therapy. (My most recent article on fate and magic is proof that at least some of us can trigger profound shifts in our ways of living largely sparked by Jungian thought).
There's also the question of action (Or 'building' as you put it). Again, Jung's core project is to construct an accurate self model. Let's imagine 2 people are each trying to make a tangible change in how they live (i.e. building a new better life). All else equal, the one who has a better understanding of their mind will do a better job of making the required changes. The 'Solid ground that you built yourself.' you mention is easier to build with more self-knowledge. But I'm repeating myself now.
That peer of yours who used 'Reflection' as an excuse to become a recluse sounds like the 'foolish new analysant' type that I'm currently reading Jung's critique of. To speculate a bit, I think this personality type is experiencing something like weak ego-inflation. Which tbf can lead to stagnant behaviour that you criticise. But I think that says more about the individual than Jung's model of the self. After all, ego-inflation is a Jungian concept.
If everytime a model doesn't work we blame the individual then we're going nowhere.
Maybe you should stop reading tweets about Jung and start reading Jung himself. The individuation process is both internal and external at the same time. Jung never said it's only internal; on the contrary, in "Memories, Dreams, Reflections" he explicitly said that the only reason he kept his sanity was because of his patients, wife, and children.
I'm sharing my own experience and what I've seen around me.
You seem to be more familiar with his message so please share your experience with individuation.
Notice I also said different philosophies work for different personalities, I don't deny he has helped people but the raft metaphor still stands for me. If the shore is available why not go for it?
the whole point of looking to your interior is to act on the exterior. that's the double character of the individuation process (which can be symbolically represented as the lab - acting on the exterior - and the library - looking to the interior - of the alchemist). I can agree that it doesn't work for everyone; I myself don't go to a Jungian analyst.
I see Jung's thought not as a raft that will save you, but as a tool, somewhat like a lens that can help you understand the World and yourself.
I agree with this: the whole point of looking to your interior is to act on the exterior.
My concern is getting lost in the interior, thus turning to passivity instead of action.
What if we acted on the exterior a little more?
I got your concern.
It's a valid one.
I'm only saying that your problem isn't with Jung or Jungian psychology, as it clearly says that your actions in the exterior are the main purpose of life itself.
And, as Jung said: "Until you make the unconscious conscious, it will direct your life and you will call it fate."
https://substack.com/@noteworthyendeavors?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android&r=8k0a9y
I agree with most of what you’re saying. If you don’t take action, nothing changes. But I also find that people act in ways that are counterproductive to their goals because they haven’t connected their past to their present beliefs. They need to do some processing of subconscious beliefs to feel that they can act in more productive ways.
No law of physics states that people need to process subconscious beliefs. We made it up. Does it work for some people? Yes it does, but it doesn't have to be an universal law. This is what I'm trying to convey with this article.
Thank you for reading!
Here is the thing..Jung was mistaken
He forgot the most important part or didn't have the science to tell him what it was about the empaths in the first place in individuation he forgot first principles... it's all about the Divergent. Who don't peek until 35.
And this Divergent has an Evidence chain all the way back from the beginning through objection AIS fraudulent start and exactly what they're planning to do .mand have already done with a 13 million seeded for it and I've got a secret secret I've got a secret! Domo arigato Mr Roboto domo domo domo
Don't know what you're saying but thank you for reading kind person